Friday , December 3 2021

Was The Derby a “dog” of a race? Is Love the Arc winner in waiting and, who lets the dogs out!?

A lively debate concerning the “dog of a race” that is now the Derby, both Ron and Sean are in awe of Love….will she now win the Arc?

The conversation then goes onto the Superlative Stakes, a race farmed in the past by the Legendary Sir Henry Cecil, and a good dose of reasoning as to what wins it this year.

Will the going scupper the chances of Golden Horde in the July Cup, or will Kevin Ryan finally get one of his home first?

The Summer Mile at Ascot looks a good opportunity for Mohaather to prove how unlucky he was at Royal Ascot….or does it?

Ron asks whether or not Jim Crowley thinks so, looking at one of Jim’s Newmarket rides as his, “before we go….” selection.

It is 39 minutes of your life you will never get back but it’s interesting horse racing debate and discussion, and you are invited to take part by sending your questions for next week Podcast.


Ron Good afternoon, sir. How the hell are you

Sean Not so bad, yourself? I see bits of blue sky out the window, along with bits of cloud. How about you?

Ron I’ve got exactly the same. I don’t believe it. It’s been atrocious this week hasn’t it.

Sean Certainly being changing the going and causing a few issues here and there for us all. But, um, that’s UK for you.

Ron Well, what I’ve done today is I’ve basically said don’t have a bet, you know, I’ve not, I’ve not sent anything out. It seems to be the most sensible thing to do. I had an email from one of the members in response to the newsletter and he said, best decision I’ve made in July.

Sean You can’t, if you’re not confident with it and the figures aren’t working because the goings changing, then it’s, then it’s time to pull stumps and wait till they are, and then make hay when the sun shines, perhaps

Ron That’s it entirely. I mean, the main ingredient in what I do is the ground. And my motto, for want of a better description, is if you give me the ground, I’ll give you the winners, take the ground away, I’m as stumped as everybody else.

Sean Good catch phrase though, like it

Ron It’s not a bad one, is it

Sean It’ll do. Yeah, you’re right. If the rain softening the ground, and then at the moment we’ve got sunshine and wind out there and the temperatures are quite warm. I’m talking down South where I am. I don’t know what the ground is going to be tomorrow, down here at all. If the, if the rain stays away and the wind stays up and the temperature is high, it’ll dry out pretty quickly. But exactly. So it’s like a night again. And then suddenly, you know, what’s it going to be tomorrow? Good to, from good to soft soft, who knows

Ron Looking at tomorrow’s racing now. Well, not now, but now. Um, and I’m seeing soft ground and then I’m looking at the weather forecast and I’m looking at the temperatures and I’m saying, well, Do do you work on a race on the basis that it’s going to be soft? You can’t. Can you,

Sean And do you believe what they tell you anyway? That’s sadly that’s true.

Ron That’s another discussion for another day

Sean No, that’s one for next week’s list, is it okay? I think so. What we talking about this week, boss.

Ron Well, can we talk about the Derby?

Sean Well, I know you’ll want to. I suspect you to start yet where are we going to disagree for the fun of it, but go on off you go. You can go first.

Ron As far as I’m concerned now, the Derby is absolutely null. And in as much as well, I mentioned last week, how, how hard it is now to try and find the winner of that race. And I gave an example of the prices of the most recent winners. And you look at the price of the first three home of last Saturday’s race. And you say, I wasn’t wrong now.

Sean That’s true.

Ron You know, if you go back to 2007, 2017 is a good starting point when Aiden O’Brien had five runners in the race. And he trained the first two home, 40 to one and five to one. Um, and the winner of that race now stands at stud for just six K.

Sean You know, it tells a story. It tells a story.

Ron And then you got the 2018. When a Massar love a woman with a race. The second horse was Derek SPI, which only ever went over two miles and the third horse was Roaring Lion, who never won beyond 10 furlongs. I’m not wearing an hour stands at stud for 15 K. Now, if you go back well, 20 years, not even, maybe not even that far, you’d say to yourself, you’ve got the winner of the Derby it’s infested fees. Yes.
Sean 10 million pound minimum price tag, 50,000 pounds a time to start with even these days. Probably. Yeah

Ron Exactly. It just doesn’t happen. I mean, wouldn’t, you hate to be a jockey now. Well, maybe you wouldn’t, but we get more possible. A top jockeys contract with the likes of Coolmore and Godolphin is that they get a share of stud fees. Yeah. True, true bias. Not we would want to be the, it would be bothered about riding the winter of a Derby now.

Sean So are you telling me that you don’t think this year’s Derby winner was any good?
Ron To be honest with you? I don’t know. Yeah.

Sean Or if I was trying to tempt you into an argument there. Yeah. Well, no, you don’t know.

Ron I mean, the horse had only ever won one race before, and that was seven days before the Derby. And it was a maiden.

Sean It was. But it was in a very good time.

Ron Yeah. I’ve never been one taken by times.

Sean I’m not, but the fastest horse in every race wins it.

Ron But at the end of the day, how that race is run, determines how fast the race at the horse wins. The race outs. You might have a race that’s run at a crawl, turns into a sprint that’s run in six seconds over standard wins. It still is a very good horse.

Sean I won’t disagree with you for a second. If you’re a coverup also, especially then you’re solely dependent on how the horse is in front run. And that mean you’ve produced at the last second to win by off the length. And it’s depends how fast they went as to what time you clock. Yeah. So I don’t disagree with you, but I think he may be a better horse than, than social media has been saying he is.
Ron Well, I’ll be honest with you. I’m with social media on this. I mean, the race was just set up for him. And when Ryan Moore was put up on the one that was crying, I forgot the name of the darn thing. It was Mogul Mogul. Right. I thought, well, that’s gotta be an indicator as to what the pecking order is, but then I thought I reminded me myself after we got off there. Exactly what’s gone on in previous years and it’s, it just doesn’t matter. It would have mattered 15, 20 years ago when Ryan would have been thinking, well, my proceeds from the, um, the stallion duties after this are going to be X, Y, millions. Now he’s thinking it’s not worth the carrot.

Sean Yeah, I don’t, I don’t disagree. I just, I got a funny feeling. He might be than recent Derby winners. I don’t think he’s a world beater. Nope. I don’t think the Derby has come as, as competitive as it used to be, but nothing was really closing on him up the home straight there. The order of those in behind didn’t really alter all that much.

Ron Well, it didn’t alter at all. I think the first three home with the first three, all the way around.

Sean I thought, sat up closer to him. This, in my opinion, their stamina would have run out. So they did what they had to do and went at their own pace to try and catch him. I just think it was a very good ride and the horse might be better than we think he is. I think we couldn’t come to injustice at the end of the season. You can say told you so, and I’ve got it all wrong, but, um,
Ron He’s just written that down.

Sean Yeah. I’m sure he’s at one place, one place caliper possibly. But I think he ran a, a brilliant race in the circumstances. It’s very well written. I don’t take anything away from those in behind. I just think he was a super-bright on the day and he got away for them, one paced and they just couldn’t close on him. Yeah.

Ron I’m going to go back to something we mentioned, which is, um, the horses these days are more bred for speed. And so what I did before we came on today was I had to look at a website called the Thoroughbred Racing Commentary. I don’t know whether you’ve ever looked at it. I was looking at the, the top 10 stallions as stand at the moment

Sean fees or top 10 by group wins

Ron by fees

Sean Okay.

Ron Frankel 75,000 quid Myla. Nice. 250,000 cred, Myla waterfronts in America, $250,000 sprinter. Then you’ve got Tapit $200,000. He was a miler, got 10 furlongs at a push. And then the other one is Medallia Dora more or less the same as Tapit’s, he stands for $200,000 as well. So when you’re looking at a Derby winner standard, the six K that you know exactly what’s going on, um, I just don’t rate the Derby as a race anymore. So now I quite simply think it’s a tradition and that’s it.

Sean Oh, I think you’re right. Um, we’ve got the game knees. We’ve got all the other top mile races, etcetera, to really map what do we got the English, Irish. Derbies Bobby’s back to a mile a quarter now, so you can ignore that. Yeah. You’ve got the arc, which in my opinion is usually a superb field, but it’s run at the end of a long, tough season. And usually on ground, that’s a bit softer and creating more of a stamina issue for some, you’ve got the King George, I suppose, but most of the top races really remodel Marla quarter now sort of sufficient suit. You want them on a quarter horse because those are the there’s more races to aim at

Ron Exactly. Now the only people who want to win the Derby. Coolmore. The influence is Galileo. He is the only top stallion standing at the moment that has one over 12 furlongs. Um, they won’t even give you a price as to how much it, um, it gets a private fee. You have to get in touch and negotiate your favorite them. Um, if you look at all the, the last few Derby winners, even the police horses, it’s all influenced by Galileo. It’s so boring now, you know, even Masar, Galileo was his grandad. You know, all you need to do now to find a winner of a job is look at the breeding, find Galileo, making sure that list of Galileo horses, put your dog, John, and go and collect simple as that

Sean Properties. If you look at the emo Brian horse, she’s quite a long list of Canada. People even come up to the one you think is going to win. But yeah,

Ron I have a, an email earlier on, before I came on from, um, one of the members Peter Wadman I peed up, and he was basically saying, before you comment on the Derby, an O’Brien House, lots of major events in recent times, it’s become more obvious. He says he does not expect any adverse comment from the jockey club. True. Last week style B was rum to a precision plan. I agree part of the plan and being that you have the rest of the old Brian jockeys, and he’s not sure, he’s not basically sure of how many of the other jockeys knew exactly what the plan was. Now. I’m going to disagree with that bit. And I’m going to say, I think they knew exactly what the plan was. Let that thing go. Everybody was going to be watching the horse that Ryan Moore was on.

Speaker 0 00:10:28 Um, because he’s the top jockey and they all got mugged. Now the Coolmore boys don’t care, which one of their horses wins the prize. It’s a heck of a pot to be winning. Um, and it’s not, as we’ve said, there’s nothing to do at stallion duties. I think he, I think you’re spot on. I think that basically he finishes with the fact that no trainer should be allowed to have more than three runners in a classic. And I agree with that. In fact, I’d go as far as to say, you’re only allowed one, um, because otherwise team tactics do come into it. It ruins the spectacle, cause it, that Derby was farcical to watch. Um, and not only that, it then puts the emphasis on a trainer to know exactly which is his number one, then think,
Speaker 1 00:11:18 Yeah, well I’m thinking out loud. I don’t agree with it at all. Um, I think that we could have coupled as opposed to owners, trainers trained at horses coupled. So it would have been four to one. I know Brian to win that race for one of an argument of a price. Therefore there’s no incentive from a punting perspective as to which order you’re going to try and finish them in. I agree with you wholeheartedly on things like we saw this week elsewhere where a particular trainer’s horse moves out off the rails or zooming through the insight. I think that that, that kind of tactics needs to be stopped. I don’t see why, if you try and horses and where you had four owners with horses, he’s good enough to run in the Derby. Why should you tell three of those owners that they can’t run?

Speaker 1 00:12:03 Because I’ll just be taking my horse away and pull up and get somewhere else. The thing is it’s not different owners. It’s all the same ownership in this case. It was, if you’re talking about training as not having more than one horse in a race, you’ve got that potential like John Gosden, for instance, where he’s got some good old thin horses and some up in the home, the horses, et cetera, et cetera. Which one, how does he tell Mr. Oppenheimer, his horse can’t run in the doll because he’s running the Godolphin horse? Well, no, maybe then in that case, you’ve got to look at it slightly differently and say that

Ron An owner. Yeah.

Sean We trained as a couple, a couple of them in the betting to stop any accusations of hanky panky for want of a better way of putting it. I don’t think this Derby was set up that way. I thought they, I think they thought they were good enough to catch him. And he’s a better horse than anyone thought he was. He’s only his third race. So there’s no reason why he can’t improve like that horse. You have to expect improvements you want. So I don’t think it’s anything untoward. I know what you mean about studying Judy’s and I do suspect that they do on occasion saying, well, if I can win a Group one here, Epsom with this horse, then we’ll send the other one to France to win a group one there, then another one to Germany to win a Group one there. Then they’ve all got black type in their, in their pedigrees and we can make some money out of it, but I’ll certainly couple them in the betting for our sake.

Speaker 1 00:13:15 So that we’re not left with a rank outside of this, given the free reign of upfront that none of us knew was going to happen. Yeah. But, um, I don’t actually think there was anything untoward in the race at all. I just think the jockeys may either got caught out or there’s simply such a lack of stamina in behind. Thanks to we what we were saying about the speedsters being the breeding, um, that they couldn’t get any anywhere. Couldn’t keep tabs on him. As simple as that. Yeah. Well, w we’re going to walk you about next Love. There’s no argument that is very kind of you to call me that, um, one of the Darby doing handsprings, Walter Philly, Walter Philly, spectacular, a famous, she was good off the beginnings, but I didn’t realize she was that good. She’s picked them up and carried them in the Oaks. Yep. Not no argument. It’s so how can I I’ll give you that one? Nope. Not even a discussion. Really. Isn’t something I can talk you about. Absolute poetry, emotion. Isn’t she really she’s brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. I mean, she’s very good for the argument. Yeah. Uh, yeah, I think so. Will she beat Enable in the Arc?

RonYeah. Yeah, I think so. What do we do? We use that as an opportunity to switch onto the coroner clips and how enable ran, or do you want to carry on about love for now?

Speaker 0 00:14:31 Um, I would like to talk about,

Speaker 1 00:14:34 Oops, excuse me. I’ve got to let the dog who let the dog out.

Speaker 0 00:14:41 Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:14:41 The wound does have live radio. That’s the beauty of it. Yeah. Yeah. Don’t look right. Brian. I think I wrote something along those. Is it in his genes as a, to train the first

Speaker 0 00:14:52 Classic winner eight days off his first winner? Or was it in the genes of the Galileo horses that he’s, that he’s got to deal with? What do you think? Well, I think anybody that goes into that game, you have to have an aptitude for it. Anyway, I was only really put the cat amongst the PGS. I’m not questioning his abilities in any way, but the thing for me is if you gave those horses to Colbeck Phil Kirby, I mean, any of those trainers that, you know, can turn the hose. Yeah. They get the same results. I nothing it’s more, well, not more, but as much a case of the knee, the surname, uh, as anything else. Um, it’s I don’t want to say use the words “born with the silver spoon in his mouth”, but it’s that type of thing. You know what I mean?

Speaker 0 00:15:43 He was buttoned. He’s always going to be given the, the animals that win those races, whether we can train them or not, they’ll find out now it only ever trained one winner before that. Yeah. You know, so I mean, not tells you everything that he’s not, he’s not up to climb the ladder of the hardware. I’m not saying everybody should have to climb a lot of the hard way, but he’s being given an opportunity and he’s taking it with both hands you need in his defence. And I do vaguely remember mentioning that I thought fancy blue, finish it a lot closer to peaceful this time around. But even though I didn’t, what’d you think of the ride on Alpine style? This is, we’re talking about the French hoax by the way. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:16:26 Yeah. I know. I know where you’re coming from. Oh yeah. Well, you have a horse that won impressively with a Turner for over a mile steps up on the quarter. Plus don’t think there’s ever a question about her stamina personally, but if she’s got the turn of foot, no one went from the front polar in behind something and sit there and use that to an authority. Yep. No, no. We think you’re the French joke you took over decides no, we’re going to try and make the running on the host that doesn’t make the running. And that’s the best thing to put in the race. Let’s just be sat there to be shot at from something else. Do not know. I’m not talking through my wallet. I might add you look at that and you think, well, why would you take the best horse in the race and find a way of losing it? I don’t know. We went to impress me quite a few bits of jokey shit this week where we really, I mean, even that one, the term that one for goals over in France, I mean the jockey, um, I’ve seen someone’s Heidi jockeys and I’ve I’ve, I’ve described them as riding like a bag of spanners, but he was, he just took the biscuits. I mean, there was some national home jockeys, but most look at them and say, you know what? I’m not so bad. Well, I suppose, you know, he does it somehow magic.

Speaker 0 00:17:41 Um, I just want to go on to, you know, you’re riding toward his stuff. Now, if anybody didn’t see it, I won’t name names, but there was a race Pontefract Rome this week. Um, top trainer baseball field race. Now what they did was they, they had a really nice short price favours in a broke little bit slowly held about the back on the rail tracking basically. Well, it was his stable companion who coming off the final band moves two horses wide. The favourite runs through on the rails and wins the race. Whilst the pacemaker from the yard drops back, finishes plum lust. Now the rules are that every horse in the race is trying to win the race. That’s right. Isn’t it?

Speaker 1 00:18:32 Yes. But it says school rule, but yeah, I can’t disagree. It’s a strange thing to see happen. I guess at the bottom line is if you’re on the favourite, you’d have gone. What a good idea that was. And if you’re on anything else you just said what a bad idea that was. Yeah. Um, should they be allowed to do it? I suspect is the question we’re asking. What if the jockey came back in afterwards and said I was tired and I rolled off the horse rode off the rail, would you? Yeah. How would you prove otherwise

Speaker 0 00:19:01 Now? Which is why nobody tries to prove it. Nobody was called and there were no questions asked. Um, and to be honest with you, you’ll see that happening time and time again through the season. Uh, no questions are ever asked. I referred you to a race. We both watched it back several years ago.

Speaker 1 00:19:20 Yeah, I remember that. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:19:22 It was only six runners. The outside, it was back from 20 to wanting to favouritism during the day. Then the thing that it was a firefighter long, six feet long sprint stalls open this thing goes 15, lends clear the jockeys behind never moved a muscle to get anywhere near it. And it won by six lens. Now I know you questioned the BHA about it on my behalf. Yeah. And all they would say to you was, well, there was the gumball London. Yeah. The story,

Speaker 1 00:19:52 The rule was broken. One of my favourites, this one regularly, there’s an Irish one years and years ago. I can’t remember the horse or the trainers. So it’s irrelevant where they pulled the train down to explain the improvement in the horse and the train. His explanation was that you had no explanation that was accepted. That was accepted. Yeah. So w w what are you up against, but then again, I don’t think the sport has been generally speaking. I think I want to make that 99.9, 9% of the time run on its merits. Otherwise there’d be no point in us looking at what we’re doing with them.

Speaker 0 00:20:25 Chocolate.

Speaker 1 00:20:28 Yeah. Who else can we go on to, can we talk about this world’s most expensive unit

Speaker 0 00:20:33 That was next on my list? 3.5 million. What do you have? 3.5 million, a horse that wins a maiden worth 3000 quid. Okay. Um, I’ll have one of those. Yeah. Of what’s out with my little on my phone.

Speaker 1 00:20:48 He’s only got a win another 1053, similar to pay back his purchase price that doesn’t include the training fees. Of course he needs to add those on as well. So

Speaker 0 00:20:57 Let’s be honest about it. He’s never going to recoup that. No, cause he can it in the first place,

Speaker 1 00:21:04 I understand that Qatar wanted to want it to have the highest value dealing that year to make a statement if you like, and they’ve done that. But as you say, he’s a three year old, so he’s missed all the classics and gone. Exactly. Even if he was good enough, he just missed all of those. I guess he’s breeding must be good. And I guess they’ll probably put into their own breeding, always breed and

Speaker 0 00:21:25 No, we had a lot of T dot and related to, to down heart and you know, it’s exceptional, which is why they paid that much money for it. But I mean, well, to be honest with you, I, since I was an email on the 30th of March to all the members, and I said, put this one in your trackers, if you can, which they could. Cause it hasn’t even been answered for a race. I incorrectly called it that Wayne, a few people have pulled me up on that.

Speaker 1 00:21:53 Yep.

Speaker 0 00:21:55 The master is yoga two to one near the night. And I was stunned at that price,

Speaker 1 00:21:59 Which suggests he might’ve needed the run because it was fairly well publicized how expensive it was, which means the sheep punters have, would have gone in with their two quid regardless. I’ve done that. I’ve been so intended people follow that sort of thing. So in fact, he went off at two to one, suggest that the Hill improve for the run. But what is he? I don’t know. He’s but he’s one of the maiden that didn’t look a particularly spectacular one to me didn’t know he could do no more than one easily. I suppose. It’d be interesting to see where he goes next. Well, I think you would go up and trip. Yeah. I don’t know.

Speaker 0 00:22:27 She was drooling on so strong at the end. That was 10 furlongs and he was running on really

Speaker 1 00:22:31 Strong idea. Well, that’s not good. Is it if you spent rewind the podcast back to the discussions about a mile and a half and you’ve got a ethical hunt stallion on your hands, but nevermind. Nevermind. If we have to. Yeah. Why not with this ground? It worries me a little bit. Cool. Where do you want to start? Oh yeah. Two year old is always good. Fun. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:22:56 Oh, well I liked that race. I mean, I used to, I used to watch out for whatever Henry Sesar was running, you know, in the mid eighties and right through the night.

Speaker 1 00:23:03 Sadly. Yes. My dad told me about it. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 0 00:23:08 You know, when he had the likes of Stevie Cauthen and pathology riding for him and I’ll tell ya he, well, he farmed that race in the 15 runnings in those years. I’ve just mentioned he won it nine times with those jockeys, you know? And he was just brilliant. He knew exactly what to targeted the race and made no mistakes that the closest I’ve seen come to him or the Hannon’s. Um, um, they’ve won six of the last 19 between them. They won it last year with that Mystery Power. Um, but I got to look at the stats for the race and you’ve got to be in the first in the tissue goes eight at the last 10. How been, you don’t want to be priced bigger than 7/1, you need to be arriving having won last time out. And that basically narrows it down to three Hudson river, seventh kingdom, a master of the seas, um, a Dutch get you a profit, the price 7/2 4/1, 5/1 at the moment. So.

Speaker 1 00:24:07 Okay, interesting. Um, you actually have, I actually haven’t thrown down my betting, stepping discuss for once he gets him. I liked Ventura tormentor. Funnily enough, the other, if you remember, I mentioned that before it finished nowhere, we’ll see if that decent six at a big price and then one next time out. Yeah. I think that’s going to go off and try and make the running. There’s a lot of front runners in here, which is interesting. Hudson front ran King Zane front runs. They think that’s possibly Johnson’s best two year old, by the way. Uh, they ensure to mentor front runs Hudson river and Kingsland. They’re all going to, I think they’re going to set it up for seventh kingdom to come from off the place.

Speaker 0 00:24:41 The problem is what’s the ground going to be like,

Speaker 1 00:24:45 Well,

Speaker 0 00:24:46 The only horse in those, in that field right now to have one on self is Master Of The Seas.

Speaker 1 00:24:53 Yeah. Fair comment. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:24:55 Five to one. Charlie, Applebee’s got a decent enough record in it. Um, uh, I’d probably go with that

Speaker 1 00:25:04 Soft ground with mostly once raised two year olds. I’m not, not in a strong position to argue one way or the other on this.

Speaker 0 00:25:12 One of those racist. Isn’t it? I know Charlie alphabet. You can trust. Um, he’s trying to the last four winners, he’s got the only horse in the race. That’s one on soft five to one 2089.

Speaker 1 00:25:24 No I can’t. I can’t, realistically I’ll go. I’m on seventh kingdom. Cause I think he looked like he did improve considerably for his debut. Very slowly away. Very green had to be nudged on quite early. And then once he picked up the bit and ran on, um, powered clear, he could be quite a nice horse, but I can’t argue with you. It’s one of those races. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:25:41 I think if you took just the fruit three on the tissue, you’ll make it a little more

Speaker 1 00:25:45 You’re in with a chance you are. You’re like, yes. Interesting. I’ve been reading Frankie Dettori his, um, opinions on this race this morning. I have to say, because I have to do, if I’m going to quote him that he’s written something for sporting index, I was reading, um, he’s on skeptical here. This is the only group one. He’s never one in the UK. Um, so he’s eager to come home in front of, he possibly can and reading between the lines I suspect different tactics will be employed and it will be produced at the very, very last moment.

Speaker 0 00:26:16 Well, I was here I think. Um, I think even though you did messy, it came a little bit too soon. <inaudible>

Speaker 1 00:26:23 Yeah. Yeah. I got there and then got mugged on the line then got mugged. Yeah. But you’d expect Palo Hume’s lane to improve surely.

Speaker 0 00:26:31 Yeah. Um, the, the, the problem with hello human Zane is that he’s trained by Kevin Ryan and he’s run nine in that race over the last 10 years. And you only have to place never other winner. I tell you love your statistics.

Speaker 1 00:26:45 I’m scribbling all this down. Well, I’m looking at well, it’s, it’s, it’s a double edged sword. You come with the stats and I’ll come with the other bits and

Speaker 0 00:26:52 Positive stuff. He’s too firm too soft.

Speaker 1 00:26:55 Ah, yeah. Well, that’s good to know. That’s good to know. Yeah. Go check your old favourites in here. Are you going to mention him or am I bored? Go on and all you loving them. You should have first

Speaker 0 00:27:04 Th the thing you’ve got to look at is how, how prolific three-year-olds have been in this race and they’ve won four to the last five running’s of this race. Um, you know, when we find the winner in the front period on the tissue and you sit in their favourites at the moment. Yep. Aiden O’Brien, he’s one, the last two of these with three year olds, but he’s already got one in it this year. That’s a 22, one outside of Southern Hills, 41. Now for two to one, now he wants to take this

Speaker 1 00:27:35 Alexa. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:27:38 You look at golden hoard and he just fits the bill from so many angles. To be honest with you, including the fact that he’s trained by cloud Cox, Clive’s had fibromas and this are two winners, but I can’t find the last few like cup that was run on soft ground. The last five were run on. Good to firm. So we’re all dealing with something totally strange here tomorrow. Tell him,

Speaker 1 00:28:01 Yeah, I agree with that. And then the, the issue, not an issue with golden hoard, but not a guarantee. It’s not a gimme that you’ll handle it. Well, no, gets you three old allowance. Hence the three year old is doing so well. You already stole my thunder yet again, because at the bottom there I have my whites up. I’ve got here. I have 33, two, one for Southern Hills. Why is I know Brian happy to put Ryan Moore up on a horse that finished way behind Golden Horde. Last I met with no obvious excuses. I know it’s just the little, little, little sneaky 10 pH way at 42.

Speaker 0 00:28:31 I’ll get the antenna. And doesn’t it. It makes you wonder, that’s all I’m saying. The only, the only sneak in thing that’s niggling away in my mind regarding golden hoard is that the only time he’s reached on ground, when there was proper Cortana, he got beat in France.

Speaker 1 00:28:46 Yeah. But if I remember right, and he wasn’t, you know, w who did he get beaten by? Wasn’t it quite good for

Speaker 0 00:28:52 Athlete? Very good for,

Speaker 1 00:28:54 Yeah, I see it. So it’s not exactly bad form, is it? No. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:28:59 He’s a, he’s a bull of a horse. He’s put, he’s probably improved the stone since last year. Ah, I’m going to have a Dutch golden holds and that one of Ryan’s hello humans. And they fit the bill from the position in the market. Um, you’ve got a three year old, so yeah, I’ll just go Dutch. Y’all notice it that’ll do me. Okay. All would be on golden horse.

Speaker 1 00:29:22 But again, it’s I know we keep saying, you know, you don’t remember, you don’t have to bet in every race. This is the thing. Oh no, no. If you fancy this race, you don’t have to, but it’s all come to that. If you fancy this race and golden horse, the one I would pick. Um, but it’s a race I’ll be watching, I think more than betting in personally.

Speaker 0 00:29:38 Oh, I think so. So the mile some online,

Speaker 1 00:29:44 I see. Yeah. Moving to moving South to me, I might ask her, I would normally have been at for this, but never mind. That’s just sour grapes for me. My Hathor sitting at two to one favorite or Lessing places came from off the pace off to getting a poor run in a, in a Group. One last time out in rural Alaska and the Queen Anne Stakes. Look, I have plenty left in a tape. I watched a couple of replays of that again and again today. And I’m not convinced he would’ve got much closer regardless. He’s he wasn’t checked completely. You’d think he’d been stopped dead in his tracks, ring to Gail a favor here. Um, what do you think you’re going to disagree on that one?

Speaker 0 00:30:19 I was, um, I was reading some comments by Jim Crowley about this horse. He was saying that as good as his week was at Roy Alaska’s the one race you’d love to ride a game. Was that one? You said he was quite sure that he should worn it. Um, he basically put it down as the one that got away. Yeah. Well, I don’t know. I was, I was helping cause that was on the window that day circus Maximus. But then if I imagined that everybody’s cutting down to what he said, because at the moment you can get nine to four him step into one bar.

Speaker 1 00:30:59 Yes. Is that value? This is the question. Mark. Do we want to find the winner? Do we want to find value or combination between the two? I suppose?

Speaker 0 00:31:07 Well, I can say I can’t see a reason to take the favourites on each one from one on soft. So the ground won’t be an issue for him. But the only thing that I’m thinking about is why isn’t Jim there riding it. Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:31:20 Yes. I’m sure. Yeah. He’s off at new market. I’m not exactly sure what one is there for. Obviously I can, but I’ve got an idea. Do you want me to record

Speaker 0 00:31:29 Lots of Kyle in the Bunbury cup? Okay.

Speaker 1 00:31:32 Oh right. You and your handicaps, but you okay.

Speaker 0 00:31:37 Well, he will not. Didn’t you tip it up to when it asks you, it was that, that one. I can’t remember from the booking and palace stakes. Didn’t it. If anything, to ask you, I’ll probably Mark

Speaker 1 00:31:49 Highly unlikely, but it’s not impossible.

Speaker 0 00:31:51 Yeah. He’s got a good book of rides there tomorrow. He’s riding about five or six old in with a green and a good chance of winning. But as you say, me and handicaps, I’ve cottoned on to this one. And I think he could actually be a group horse and a handicap.

Speaker 1 00:32:05 You tip him to ask it. And he did one with, with plenty in hand, to be honest. Yeah,

Speaker 0 00:32:08 He did. He skirted off now. He was favourably drawn on the day. But then so were the others that shows the prices down from the same owner? Yep. He picked the outside or the loss of them shake Hamdan’s didn’t they that day. Yep. I think we mentioned that now, as I say, I think he’s a Group house IN a handicap. That the thing, again, it’s a niggle, but when he got beat on, um, good to soft last year, Hanlon said it was the ground that beat him. He’s better on the sound surface. But the funny thing is when he won the booking and palace stakes, it was the good to soft ground that he’d been beaten on in his last race. Last year, I’ve got a feeling. It was maybe a little bit of a niggle on that day. Cause he finished way behind the horse. He’d beaten previously the time before I do, I just, I just think this is a Group horse in a handicap.

Speaker 1 00:33:03 I don’t disagree with you. It’s just going to end up being your one for the weekend or yeah. How you cleverly put that in there. Like that? I don’t know.

Speaker 0 00:33:12 Well, I thought I thought said to me before we go is mine. You can have it now. It’s multicultural in the Bunbury. Cool. Okay. Great. That race. But I’m not going to file as we figured till tomorrow when I know that it’s gone good to soft again, uh, which you probably will do. Um, hopefully it gets a crack in good racing and we can all fill our boots.

Speaker 1 00:33:34 Okay. We’ll have a it back. Just, just, just while it seems I’ve written this out. I’m not going to get my money’s worth, but some of them all, I think San Donato has got a little each way. Squeak. Roger what’d you Varian sprinter 12 to one various girls doing. Okay. He’s obviously had some niggles he’s been off for over a year, but um, he’s got some decent form and I think he might have a squeaker, a price, nothing worth saying other than that really? Okay. Where do we want to go next? Not like one 52. I mentioned before we run out of time, last week we promised to ask about flag starts.

Speaker 0 00:34:07 Oh, right. Yeah.

Speaker 1 00:34:10 And I said to them, how as a handicap, how would you assess flag thoughts? We were questioning what happens with a Flagstar. If you start like five links behind everything else, how to handicap handicappers view this. And they’ve been kind enough to reply. My reply comes from a domino Dominique Gardner Hill who’s head of handicapping. All right. Which is quite nice to hear isn’t it? It is. And I quote, when assessing any race, we will be looking at it from all sorts of angles, determining the variables that have led it to the result. These would include ground conditions, effect of the draw piece of the race tactics used lucking running, whether the field splits in races down a straight course, recent form who horse crew file, et cetera. The fact that the race was started by flag will obviously also be considered, did it leave certain horses advantage and others at a disadvantage? And then this is the bit where someone says I’m correct for a change as such. You are correct with your suggestion, a horse getting lifted a Flagstar will largely be treated the same as a horse, starting slowly from a set of stalls. So if they answered any questions in your mind, my mind, or anybody listening to last week’s podcast mind, hopefully you now have an answer. Yeah.

Speaker 0 00:35:11 Well at least they have a good enough to reply and let you know.

Speaker 1 00:35:14 Well, it’s nice that, that I think they take an awful lot of stick at. Sometimes they deserve it and sometimes they don’t. Um, but brownie points to them there. They bother to reply and to give a detailed reply at that. Yeah. Good. Awesome. Where are we? What we left with now?

Speaker 0 00:35:29 Well, what I wanted to do was just basically finish off, um, with the improvements that we’ve made to the post racing Dakota UK. Good. Well then

Speaker 1 00:35:38 Can I, do you want me to chop my something for the weekend in before I get going quick, quick, quick, quick. Okay. I’m not spaced out to, that’s a bit of a bad joke there, but I’m going to be on Eureka. Karin. I just thought about that. I’m sorry. It’s a dad joke. Yuri Gagarin in the new market on Saturday. Uh, John goes is North and I picked something in a handicap and impressive winter of both the stars on the, or whether I’m reading this. You can tell, um, Luke, we had more to give when taking in all stakes at Kempton in the middle of last month, Frankie, rising for John Golden. And Godolphin, he’s another one. I wouldn’t be surprised to find that he’s not a handicapper. He’s better than that. It could be thrown off the writing in 95. If he handles this off the ground, which is the big unknown for most of the houses out this weekend. So that’s my something for the weekend. Eureka, Karen, I’ll close there and you can move on to

Speaker 0 00:36:25 What you want you to talk to Well, I’ve had the, I’ve had a pig of a week trying to get all this sorted out because I’m, I’m okay at it. But what these people tend to do is they, they treat you like, you know, everything because they know everything. Anyway. Um, I managed to finally get the website moved over from the old host to the new host. And if you’ve checked, the speed of the site of the moments is lightening fast. And what I’d be doing, what I’ll be doing this week is making it even quicker. Now we’re going to start using the website a heck of a lot more because of this. So I’m going to be putting things like in the ratings from way back when, so that if you need to have a look at how the ratings performed at sundown in July, 2017, you’ll be able to put it in the search bar and it’ll come up.

Speaker 0 00:37:22 Now, it’s going to take me a little while to do all that, but that’s eventually going to be there. But the primary reason for doing it with some of the people can listen to the podcast. We should be used to popular. Oh, you should’ve seen my inbox last week. Um, the frustration you could read it, you could feel it coming out to the emails that I was getting. And I’m not in Tam was making me equally frustrated because what happened to me was that I was trying to put the podcast on the website and the website crashed out, shows people were there before the podcast was up and it drove me to distraction. It took me till 10, four o’clock I think it was to actually get on the site and put it on. But now hopefully fingers crossed. We’ve got these problems sorted it’s cost me money, but what the heck? Let’s get it done.

Speaker 1 00:38:13 Well, I was always, always told it was Kim Kardashian’s backside that crashed the internet. It was called insurance podcast.

Speaker 0 00:38:23 Nevermind. So yeah. So I’m going, gonna conclude here now I’ll get this done. I’ll get it on the side. I’ll let everybody know it’s there and then cross my fingers. I can tell it. Yeah, I think it okay.

Speaker 1 00:38:36 Have a good weekend. Give me one. He will be back next week. Any questions? Of course. Don’t forget to send them into Ron. He’d love to answer them. I’m sure. I’m sure. Even if you just got a comment, you want to make our, read it out. Yeah. We’re here. We’re here to serve you and not the other way round. So you feel the way around that’s okay. But do weekend then Friday so I can take care. Bye bye.

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Post Racing
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